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  #541  
Old 09-11-13, 03:31 PM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatAlum View Post
You're getting somewhat Clintonesque here, parsing my words. Let me do it back to you.

Recruiting goes on...that's not the same thing as illegal recruiting, a distinction I always make (note that I said "yes, there is athletic recruiting, and SOME of it crosses the line"...meaning that some of it doesn't. All private schools recruit their entire student body, athletes and non-athletes. Some private schools recruit their student-athletes within the bounds of the OHSAA. I'd say most do it most of the time. Some are a little more slippery.

The point is this...leave the OHSAA, stay in the OHSAA...Ignatius still has 1400 students, 14k sticker price per student in tuition, $5 million going out in financial aid every year. I doubt a move to some other sports administrative format will change things very much. You IMPLY that private schools will feel free to open up, get aggressive in this area. I think you're wrong...the money isn't there to behave that way.
If SOME of it crosses the line, does that mean it is illegal? Or by saying 'crossing the line', do you mean something else?

I imply nothing. I merely state it will be more accepted. If I imply anything, I imply that any and all schools involved in any other sort of league also recruit and also would be accepting of it.

By you stating what I supposedly intend to imply, you are merely inserting your opinion into my point.

I am very interested in your last line.

'the money isn't there to behave that way'

Without making any assumptions as to what you imply, can you explain this further?

Last edited by EastYoungstown; 09-11-13 at 03:36 PM.. Reason: trying to be nice
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  #542  
Old 09-11-13, 04:25 PM
CatAlum CatAlum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
If SOME of it crosses the line, does that mean it is illegal? Or by saying 'crossing the line', do you mean something else?

I imply nothing. I merely state it will be more accepted. If I imply anything, I imply that any and all schools involved in any other sort of league also recruit and also would be accepting of it.

By you stating what I supposedly intend to imply, you are merely inserting your opinion into my point.

I am very interested in your last line.

'the money isn't there to behave that way'

Without making any assumptions as to what you imply, can you explain this further?
You have a viewpoint that is common to high school sports fans. You'd never assume that what Glenville does with recruiting/student acquisition/call it what you will, would tell you anything about how Boardman goes about its business or Euclid or Fairview Park. But it's clear from your comments that you think one private/Catholic school is just like every other private/Catholic schools. If the privates went out on their own, they'd all get together and have a common understanding of recruiting rules and practices (very loose apparently is what you believe). That's wrong...based on my experience.

Yes, "crossing the line" means "illegal" at least in terms of violating OHSAA rules. I've seen privates and publics do it. I suspect that most schools, public and private, have at least violated the spirit of the OHSAA rules on occasion. But the quantity of the violations differs dramatically from school to school.

Finally, my comment about money...some think (perhaps you) that aggressive sports recruiting is good for the bottom line of a private school. I know that it's not. My money comment...chasing athletes to go to your private school is bad for business...simple as that.
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  #543  
Old 09-11-13, 04:27 PM
Br. Joe Br. Joe is offline
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Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
Are the Mooney and Buchtel series definitely over after this year?
I have no intel. That's just my hunch (about the Buchtel series ending).
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  #544  
Old 09-11-13, 04:30 PM
slammer20 slammer20 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatAlum View Post
You're misunderstanding my point to a degree. I think the publics could potentially be in control here.

1. Stop playing the privates (already happening).
2. One or more private schools can't find 8 games to schedule (or do not have the economic wherewithal to schedule 8 games in these circumstances...either "buying" games against weak opponents or traveling long distance to play games).
3. Private schools that can't find 8 games aren't eligible for OHSAA playoffs.
4. Private that can't find 8 games go to OHSAA for relief.
5. Public school dominated OHSAA, while unable to muster the votes to separate, also can't muster the votes to do something to help a private school who can't get 8 games (like adopt the Pa. model).
6. Impasse...privates are forced to go out on their own.

So, I'm not saying the privates will go out there looking to form a super division, but the time may not be too far off where some portion of about 10-15 Ohio schools can't find enough games to be part of the OHSAA structure and the OHSAA will be unable/unwilling to do anything about it.
I was simply referring to the new 64 Division 1 format as the super division, but you bring up some interesting points.
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  #545  
Old 09-11-13, 05:43 PM
oldmanfbfan oldmanfbfan is offline
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catalum

Why doesn't St. Ed's schedule Walsh, Toledo St. Francis, or Toledo St. John's? Many D2 schools play a tough D1 schedule. Twinsburg is playing 6 D1 schools this and next year.
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  #546  
Old 09-12-13, 04:59 AM
fballfan fballfan is offline
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Sorry to change topic... But I think this game will be a key for the Eagles as the schedule gets a bit tougher over the next few weeks. Saturday's game will be key on a few fronts. The team needs to show some more discipline as they were nailed for a number of penalties last week against Buchtel. The defense needs to hone in on opponents running attack, IE GVille rushing for 120 plus yards in third quarter. While they played well against buchtel, the griffins are not a good team. I am hoping woodson can make st ed's step up their game as they soon will play a stretch of five games against teams that will show more weapons than the first two teams combined. Woodson is coming into this came 1-1. Last week they beat a very weak Roosevelt team from DC and lost 20-14 to an always tough Martinsburg team which is considered a very good squad from the west virginia area. Woodson could prove to be a good measuring stick as they have similar type players like Glenville. Once again the key will be the big uglies on both sides of the football.
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  #547  
Old 09-12-13, 07:35 AM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatAlum View Post
You have a viewpoint that is common to high school sports fans. You'd never assume that what Glenville does with recruiting/student acquisition/call it what you will, would tell you anything about how Boardman goes about its business or Euclid or Fairview Park. But it's clear from your comments that you think one private/Catholic school is just like every other private/Catholic schools. If the privates went out on their own, they'd all get together and have a common understanding of recruiting rules and practices (very loose apparently is what you believe). That's wrong...based on my experience.

Yes, "crossing the line" means "illegal" at least in terms of violating OHSAA rules. I've seen privates and publics do it. I suspect that most schools, public and private, have at least violated the spirit of the OHSAA rules on occasion. But the quantity of the violations differs dramatically from school to school.

Finally, my comment about money...some think (perhaps you) that aggressive sports recruiting is good for the bottom line of a private school. I know that it's not. My money comment...chasing athletes to go to your private school is bad for business...simple as that.
I don't care a thing about recruiting. I don't care if or how it goes on. I don't. I realize that kids go to different schools for all sorts of reasons.

I mentioned the word recruiting and your thin skin when it comes to that topic was exposed. That much is obvious.

I realize it's not the same situation at every school and I know every school, public or private, is not the same.

I realize it's not good business. It's done for vanity. That's it. BUT with a total tuition of 19 million and more than 25% of that coming from aid, 5 million as you say, I'd imagine they can help a few football players in and not hurt the bottom line. Let's not be naive.

It seems to me from the tone of your posts that you think I favor a split. You think I'm anti-privates and think they should be out of the OHSAA. You think that I believe all privates recruit and that's not fair. That what it seems like, I could be wrong.

You could not be any further from the truth.

I think you should take some time and read back a page or two and see where this started. I think you're confused about what the original thought was.

We can continue this via PM if you like.

Last edited by EastYoungstown; 09-12-13 at 11:28 AM..
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  #548  
Old 09-12-13, 11:22 AM
EaglePride01 EaglePride01 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fballfan View Post
Sorry to change topic... But I think this game will be a key for the Eagles as the schedule gets a bit tougher over the next few weeks. Saturday's game will be key on a few fronts. The team needs to show some more discipline as they were nailed for a number of penalties last week against Buchtel. The defense needs to hone in on opponents running attack, IE GVille rushing for 120 plus yards in third quarter. While they played well against buchtel, the griffins are not a good team. I am hoping woodson can make st ed's step up their game as they soon will play a stretch of five games against teams that will show more weapons than the first two teams combined. Woodson is coming into this came 1-1. Last week they beat a very weak Roosevelt team from DC and lost 20-14 to an always tough Martinsburg team which is considered a very good squad from the west virginia area. Woodson could prove to be a good measuring stick as they have similar type players like Glenville. Once again the key will be the big uglies on both sides of the football.
Internet broadcast for the game?
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  #549  
Old 09-12-13, 12:07 PM
slammer20 slammer20 is offline
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DC Woodson contest will be broadcast via iHigh at 2 PM Saturday the 14th...

http://www.ihigh.com/stedward/broadc...?silverlight=1

Enjoy the contest and go Eagles!
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  #550  
Old 09-12-13, 12:55 PM
CatAlum CatAlum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
I don't care a thing about recruiting. I don't care if or how it goes on. I don't. I realize that kids go to different schools for all sorts of reasons.

I mentioned the word recruiting and your thin skin when it comes to that topic was exposed. That much is obvious.
What concerns me is proper language usage. It is common (you fall into it here) to use the word "recruiting" improperly. Private schools "recruit" their entire student body and there's nothing wrong with it. What is of interest in forums like this is "illegal recruiting" or athletic recruiting. So, yes, when people use the word recruiting improperly (as you have), I point it out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
I realize it's not the same situation at every school and I know every school, public or private, is not the same.

I realize it's not good business. It's done for vanity. That's it. BUT with a total tuition of 19 million and more than 25% of that coming from aid, 5 million as you say, I'd imagine they can help a few football players in and not hurt the bottom line. Let's not be naive.
You know it's not good business, but "I know you do it". So, OK, you get to have it both ways...and you can be ignorant about the a specific school (as you point out, they're all different...how so?), but you still know it happens. You've got the whole topic covered here. Congrats.
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  #551  
Old 09-12-13, 01:09 PM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatAlum View Post
What concerns me is proper language usage. It is common (you fall into it here) to use the word "recruiting" improperly. Private schools "recruit" their entire student body and there's nothing wrong with it. What is of interest in forums like this is "illegal recruiting" or athletic recruiting. So, yes, when people use the word recruiting improperly (as you have), I point it out.



You know it's not good business, but "I know you do it". So, OK, you get to have it both ways...and you can be ignorant about the a specific school (as you point out, they're all different...how so?), but you still know it happens. You've got the whole topic covered here. Congrats.
I'm guessing you either didn't read my response all the way through or don't PM. No problem.

Let's continue.

I see we've gone to the 'you know everything so why continue' defense. Not surprised. I was told by others that this would happen if we continued this conversation. That's fine. I'm game.

You still haven't gone back and read anything have you? You should.

I have a few questions.

What word should be used here instead of 'recruiting'? I figured it was a good catch all term for how and why kids go to open enrollemnt schools, but I see you are not comfortable with that term and feel the need to correct me. No problem. Like I said above, thin skin makes people sensitive to certain words. So what term are you comfortable with? You decide and I will use a term that you find acceptable.

Ignorant of the school in question? You sure about that? You REALLY sure about that? I'm not sure you should make such accusations. I'm not sure you think that you think I know as much as I know that I know.

Also, it sounds like you are saying that just because it's 'not good business' that it doesn't go on. Is that what you are saying?
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  #552  
Old 09-12-13, 01:57 PM
CatAlum CatAlum is offline
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Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
What word should be used here instead of 'recruiting'?
You can call me thin-skinned. I'll call you clumsy. Whatever. The proper term is "illegal recruiting". Private school people (me, others) know that recruiting is what we do for an entire student body. When people like you use the term "recruiting" in the manner that you do, it suggest (perhaps unintentionally, ignorantly) that everything that a private school does to attract students is suspect.


Quote:
Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
Also, it sounds like you are saying that just because it's 'not good business' that it doesn't go on. Is that what you are saying?
I've already acknowledged that it goes on. You should read back and then PM me . What I said is that it is not sound practice. Does it go on, to varying degrees, at most schools? Yes. Is it common practice at a given school, part of the "business plan"? To me, that's the issue and, if it's part of the business plan, the school is stupid, foolish...and guilty of "illegal recruiting".
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  #553  
Old 09-12-13, 02:16 PM
slammer20 slammer20 is offline
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OK... enough with the rhetoric on this football thread. Please take it to PM as EY suggested in an earlier post.

BTW, for those that missed last week's contest against Buchtel, visit iHigh's website. The entire game is recorded there for your viewing pleasure.
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  #554  
Old 09-12-13, 02:28 PM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CatAlum View Post
You can call me thin-skinned. I'll call you clumsy. Whatever. The proper term is "illegal recruiting". Private school people (me, others) know that recruiting is what we do for an entire student body. When people like you use the term "recruiting" in the manner that you do, it suggest (perhaps unintentionally, ignorantly) that everything that a private school does to attract students is suspect.




I've already acknowledged that it goes on. You should read back and then PM me . What I said is that it is not sound practice. Does it go on, to varying degrees, at most schools? Yes. Is it common practice at a given school, part of the "business plan"? To me, that's the issue and, if it's part of the business plan, the school is stupid, foolish...and guilty of "illegal recruiting".
Private school people?

I knew you assumed I was a 'public school person' and I was right. You had me stereotyped so that's why it was kinda fun to watch you keep assuming and not let up. It kinda sickens me when people assume that one must be one or the other. You just love to jump down the throat of people that you assume are not like yourself and therefore think they don't know anything. You make me puke.

A quick history.

I follow Mooney and have had a stepson attend Ursuline. My father, aunt and uncle all attended parochials. That same uncle was a priest at St. Pat's here in Youngstown and ran the elementary school there for many years. I have siblings that have attended Padua and Magnificat. My father actually coached 'little Chuckie Kyle' as he calls him, many, many moons ago. I did not attend a private because there was not one within a reasonable distance of Medina, where I grew up, for me to attend way back when.

Does this make me a private school person? I don't think so. I think i have a pretty good idea what both sides are like though and how they operate. I don't really consider myself either to be honest. It is fun to watch people get so fired up about one side or the other though.

I have read back. You still haven't acknowledged my original point though. That leads me to believe you still haven't. You jumped right in after seeing the word 'recruiting' and couldn't help yourself. Some folks see certain words and just can't help themselves.

Business plan? I never said anything about a 'business plan'. You'd never see anything like that in a 'business plan' for any school. Be real.

'People like you'? Oh please do tell oh wise one. I can't wait to hear this one. What do you mean by 'people like you'?

Once again, continue this on here if you like, otherwise send me a PM.

If not, thanks for your time.
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  #555  
Old 09-12-13, 02:34 PM
arizonawildcat arizonawildcat is offline
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Don't hijack the St. Ed's thread.
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  #556  
Old 09-12-13, 02:36 PM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Originally Posted by slammer20 View Post
OK... enough with the rhetoric on this football thread. Please take it to PM as EY suggested in an earlier post.

BTW, for those that missed last week's contest against Buchtel, visit iHigh's website. The entire game is recorded there for your viewing pleasure.
apologies
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  #557  
Old 09-12-13, 02:37 PM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Originally Posted by arizonawildcat View Post
Don't hijack the St. Ed's thread.
apologies to all
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  #558  
Old 09-12-13, 03:45 PM
CatAlum CatAlum is offline
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Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
Private school people?
Never said you WEREN'T a private school person and didn't even suggest it. But people that ARE from private schools don't use the word "recruiting" the way you do. We're talking past one another.
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  #559  
Old 09-12-13, 03:54 PM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Originally Posted by CatAlum View Post
Never said you WEREN'T a private school person and didn't even suggest it.
That's f$#king hilarious.

They've requested we take it to a PM. I've tried.

Look towrads the topr right corner of the creen. You should see something like this.

Welcome, CatAlum.
You last visited: 09-12-13 at 03:10 PM
Private Messages


Now click the word 'private messages'

thank you
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  #560  
Old 09-12-13, 04:16 PM
Jamaal28 Jamaal28 is offline
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10th game?

Max Preps is showing the Eagles traveling to Florida playing Chaminade-Madonna (Hollywood, FL) in week 10. Any truth to that? I noticed on maxpreps website that the Elder game is missing, so I'm not sure if this is correct.
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  #561  
Old 09-12-13, 04:35 PM
slammer20 slammer20 is offline
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Originally Posted by Jamaal28 View Post
Max Preps is showing the Eagles traveling to Florida playing Chaminade-Madonna (Hollywood, FL) in week 10. Any truth to that? I noticed on maxpreps website that the Elder game is missing, so I'm not sure if this is correct.
The same website indicated the Eagles lost in game 1. No, the Eagles play EC Academy to conclude the season and I will be personally attending the Eagles versus Panthers contest at 6 PM on September 21st at JCU.

Go Eagles!
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  #562  
Old 09-12-13, 04:39 PM
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Actually, MaxPreps shows Chaminade-Madonna plaing St. Eds in Week 11. I am kind of hoping we have a playoff game that weekend.

Some kind of error I'd guess. Eds already added Eastern CHristian (Maryland) for Week 10. Week 7 is the open date.
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  #563  
Old 09-12-13, 08:34 PM
Br. Joe Br. Joe is offline
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EP01, any Herb updates this week?
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  #564  
Old 09-12-13, 08:59 PM
eaglepride eaglepride is offline
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I remember the eagles played chaminade - Madonna in 2006 at Lakewood stadium with the eagles winning 14 - 7.
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  #565  
Old 09-13-13, 06:02 AM
EaglePride01 EaglePride01 is offline
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EP01, any Herb updates this week?
Didn't attend, but it appears the Green team lost 7-0 to Walsh on Wednesday according to Norm Weber's write-up. The Walsh game was on the Gold schedule, so I'm not sure what happened. The Green is also supposed to play Elyria Catholic this Saturday.
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  #566  
Old 09-14-13, 07:57 AM
sehs sehs is offline
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Apparently there was a bit of a snafu with Walsh not wanting to play our Gold team, not sure what it was but they ended up playing the Green team obviously. Gold did not have a game this week then.
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  #567  
Old 09-14-13, 01:56 PM
CuriousGeorge1 CuriousGeorge1 is offline
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Game is in the backyard today right?
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  #568  
Old 09-14-13, 02:11 PM
slammer20 slammer20 is offline
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No, Lakewood HS... 42-0 at the half.
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  #569  
Old 09-14-13, 02:49 PM
mailman112 mailman112 is offline
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Originally Posted by EaglePride01 View Post
Didn't attend, but it appears the Green team lost 7-0 to Walsh on Wednesday according to Norm Weber's write-up. The Walsh game was on the Gold schedule, so I'm not sure what happened. The Green is also supposed to play Elyria Catholic this Saturday.
I have been told the Gold Freshman team will not play for 3 straight weeks. All 3 opponents have cancelled.

Last edited by mailman112; 09-14-13 at 06:41 PM.. Reason: Spelling
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  #570  
Old 09-14-13, 03:02 PM
slammer20 slammer20 is offline
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Eagles win 49-0 with a running clock instituted in the 2nd half. A bunch of speed on this team in all areas. They need to eliminate penalties.

Go Eagles!
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