Blast from the Past

[Lancermania]

It's hard to believe this year is the 40th anniversary of Colerain winning the AAA State title in cross Country with what was at the time the lowest point total (48) in the big school division after the state went to three division in 1970. Kent Roosevelt would break that mark two years later with a total of 44. Those two scores along with St. Xavier's 2013 total of 46 remain to this day the lowest recorded totals in AAA/DI.

I was coaching at the main feeder school for Colerain at the time at White Oak Junior high school. I remember standing behind the starting line as all the Colerain runners were at the back of the pack at the beginning of the race. Those guys would move up during the whole race to finish 4-6-8-11-19 with a 21 second 1-5 split. Their story was relived today in the Cincinnati Enquirer.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/spo...mps/751441002/

[JAVMAN83]

Originally Posted by Lancermania

It's hard to believe this year is the 40th anniversary of Colerain winning the AAA State title in cross Country with what was at the time the lowest point total (48) in the big school division after the state went to three division in 1970. Kent Roosevelt would break that mark two years later with a total of 44. Those two scores remain to this day the lowest recorded totals in AAA/DI.

I was coaching at the main feeder school for Colerain at the time at White Oak Junior high school. I remember standing behind the starting line as all the Colerain runners were at the back of the pack at then beginning of the race. Those guys would move up during the whole race to finish 4-6-8-11-19 with a 21 second 1-5 split. Their story was relived today in the Cincinnati Enquirer.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/spo...mps/751441002/

Nice article, and well deserved recognition for all involved. I was but a wee lad in Jr. High at the time and my world was just beginning to revolve around track and field. I knew nothing of the XC world for many years to come, but do remember, and even have articles of the Colerain track teams of the '78-'79 seasons. I was in the old HCNL, whereas Colerain was in the HCAL, but I do remember reading about Meibs and how large his teams were. At 13yrs of age, I was impressed by the Colerain squad. I think it is still one of the better and "tighter" teams of the past 40 years IMHO. Kudos to what they accomplished back then.

[Seek Up]

Originally Posted by Lancermania

It's hard to believe this year is the 40th anniversary of Colerain winning the AAA State title in cross Country with what was at the time the lowest point total (48) in the big school division after the state went to three division in 1970. Kent Roosevelt would break that mark two years later with a total of 44. Those two scores remain to this day the lowest recorded totals in AAA/DI.
I was coaching at the main feeder school for Colerain at the time at White Oak Junior high school. I remember standing behind the starting line as all the Colerain runners were at the back of the pack at then beginning of the race. Those guys would move up during the whole race to finish 4-6-8-11-19 with a 21 second 1-5 split. Their story was relived today in the Cincinnati Enquirer.

https://www.cincinnati.com/story/spo...mps/751441002/

Lancer - you know better than this. Please give credit where it's due...

[fanofrunning]

Originally Posted by Seek Up

Lancer - you know better than this. Please give credit where it's due...

I think I know where you're going with this.

[Lancermania]

Good to see you on here again, Seek Up. Do you think I omitted the 2013 team on purpose just to get you out and on here or was it just an honest mistake on my part. Seek Up's beloved St. Xavier Bombers split Colerain and Kent Roosevelt's totals in 2013 by scoring 46 points. Since Colerain and Kent Roosevelt were both running at 2.5 miles and St. Xavier at 5k, the question is raised if St. Xavier's total is the best. Maybe our engineer JAVMAN83 can chime in here. Is a lower total at a longer distance better than a lower total at a shorter distance or is it the reverse. Does it become harder to get a low total at the shorter distance?

[Lancermania]

That 2013 St. Xavier team would go on to finish second at the Nike Cross Midwest Regional and receive an automatic bid to qualify as a team. In 2012, St. Xavier accepted an ex-large bid to the Nike Cross Nationals in Portland for finishing third at the Midwest meet, then was told by the OHSAA that they could not take money from Nike to go there, so they had to raise the funds on their own. We all can thank St. Xavier for getting that changed, so the 2013 team was able to go there at Nike's expense.

[Lancermania]

St. Xavier was the DI Ohio state champions in both 2012 (71) and 2013 (46) and went on to finish 9th at the Nike Cross Nationals in 2012 (251) and 6th in 2013 (228). Now have I made up for my oversight and given credit where credit is due.

[JAVMAN83]

Originally Posted by Lancermania

Good to see you on here again, Seek Up. Do you think I omitted the 2013 team on purpose just to get you out and on here or was it just an honest mistake on my part. Seek Up's beloved St. Xavier Bombers split Colerain and Kent Roosevelt's totals in 2013 by scoring 46 points. Since Colerain and Kent Roosevelt were both running at 2.5 miles and St. Xavier at 5k, the question is raised if St. Xavier's total is the best. Maybe our engineer JAVMAN83 can chime in here. Is a lower total at a longer distance better than a lower total at a shorter distance or is it the reverse. Does it become harder to get a low total at the shorter distance?

I think the answer would depend on the individual endurance & competitive make-ups of the particular teams in a given year. I don't know if that is a measurable variable without significant amounts of data.

However, if someone is willing to do the analyses, one might go back and compare point totals of teams over the old 2.5 mile boys' standard state meet distance vs. the current 5K. There might be some difference in outcomes , but I suspect that because there's only a 0.6 miles difference between the two (~24% increase in distance), there might not be much difference between the two outcomes.

If the state meet ever goes to 8K, which I would suggest they do as boys are more than capable of it (I think would be a better measure of a truer aerobic capacity), then I think you might see a greater difference in point total outcomes between the shorter vs. longer distance.

[warriorblue]

Originally Posted by JAVMAN83

I think the answer would depend on the individual endurance & competitive make-ups of the particular teams in a given year. I don't know if that is a measurable variable without significant amounts of data.

However, if someone is willing to do the analyses, one might go back and compare point totals of teams over the old 2.5 mile boys' standard state meet distance vs. the current 5K. There might be some difference in outcomes , but I suspect that because there's only a 0.6 miles difference between the two (~24% increase in distance), there might not be much difference between the two outcomes.

If the state meet ever goes to 8K, which I would suggest they do as boys are more than capable of it (I think would be a better measure of a truer aerobic capacity), then I think you might see a greater difference in point total outcomes between the shorter vs. longer distance.

Thanks for sharing. I did know about this but didn't know the inside storyline. My brother is very fond of Frank. He also always had good things to say about him.

[JAVMAN83]

Speaking of a blast from the past, I found the attached picture of Colerain HS circa 1967. I lifted this from an online copy of the 1967 Colerain yearbook. Quite a bit has changed! You can see the existence of the old 220 yard straightaway on the right side of the track.

[Lancermania]

I ran on that track in 1967, won the 880 yard run. Wasn't the straightaway on the north side of the track.

[tmk]

Originally Posted by JAVMAN83

Speaking of a blast from the past, I found the attached picture of Colerain HS circa 1967. I lifted this from an online copy of the 1967 Colerain yearbook. Quite a bit has changed! You can see the existence of the old 220 yard straightaway on the right side of the track.

Are there any tracks still in competitive use that have the 220 yard spur?

Just interested; I can't think of the last time I even saw one.

[JAVMAN83]

Originally Posted by tmk

Are there any tracks still in competitive use that have the 220 yard spur?

Just interested; I can't think of the last time I even saw one.

Hmmm...none in use that I'm aware of.

I did see the remnants of one at Indian Riffle Park in Dayton a number of years ago. You can still see it on satellite photos

[JAVMAN83]

Originally Posted by Lancermania

I ran on that track in 1967, won the 880 yard run. Wasn't the straightaway on the north side of the track.

Yes, you are correct. If you look at Bing or Google maps, you can see from the orientation of the buildings to the track, that yes, the old spur was on the north side of the facility!