If you guys do not see a difference between football and the other sports, then there is nothing more that can be discussed. I can't argue with stupid.
If enrollment means nothing, then why are their divisions in sports in Ohio? Also, it is now abudantly clear, according to your logic, that Wayne just does not have the same kind of commitment as St. X does.
I have a spreadsheet where I report the scores of every game in the state of Ohio for my power ratings. You would be surprised how many times the smaller schools beat the bigger in football. As for St. Xavier, Wayne is 2-1 against the Bombers in the playoffs so I am not sure what you are trying to get at. That is 800 boys vs 1200 and last meeting Wayne defeated them.
Ask me this, why does Coldwater, Marion Local, and DSJ dominate small town football? Because they live it and put in the hard work to become successful.
Bring back the MML and the GMVC, I don't care but right now we have what we have. Does it benefit the Central? Yes it has but early on the North fared well in cross-over games, it was the South that took a beating.
I have looked it up. The North and South have both been whipped. For some reason, Lebanon and Springboro never played Central teams. Believe me, I have researched this.
I have a spreadsheet where I report the scores of every game in the state of Ohio for my power ratings. You would be surprised how many times the smaller schools beat the bigger in football. As for St. Xavier, Wayne is 2-1 against the Bombers in the playoffs so I am not sure what you are trying to get at. That is 800 boys vs 1200 and last meeting Wayne defeated them.
Ask me this, why does Coldwater, Marion Local, and DSJ dominate small town football? Because they live it and put in the hard work to become successful.
And they do not play teams that are two times there size. Seriously, this is not hard to figure out. What happened this past year when St. Henry decided to play up against Eaton? They got whipped. What happened when Coldwater played up against Kenton? What happened when St. Johns played up against the team from Detroit?
When teams have to consistently play up against much larger schools, they lose a significant amount of those games.
What is Trotwood's record against Wayne over the last 5 years?
And they do not play teams that are two times there size. Seriously, this is not hard to figure out. What happened this past year when St. Henry decided to play up against Eaton? They got whipped. What happened when Coldwater played up against Kenton? What happened when St. Johns played up against the team from Detroit?
When teams have to consistently play up against much larger schools, they lose a significant amount of those games.
What is Trotwood's record against Wayne over the last 5 years?
Kenton? Coldwater beat them the year before but anyhow, Kenton was 6-0 against teams in higher divisions then them...
Eaton? They also lost to St. Henry two years ago, Eaton was 2-1 against teams in higher divisions last year.
DSJ? Down year for them but still, they played one of the top D1 teams in Michigan and only lost 14-7. They were 2-3 against teams in higher divions than them. In the previous year they were 6-0.
I have looked it up. The North and South have both been whipped. For some reason, Lebanon and Springboro never played Central teams. Believe me, I have researched this.
Didn't Springboro play Centerville the last 2 years? If I'm not mistaking they play them again this year as well as Fairmont
I think Reed is going to be a great pick up for the Warriors. Not sure if he will stay at QB. There is a lot of depth there for the Warriors. I could see Reed at DB or RB. I know some has said that Reed also plays basketball, does he run track ?
Devin ran track in middle school, but not as a freshmen. He is a very good basketball player, but he needs to learn to play defense on the other end of the court. I agree he would make a great DB or RB, but those positions he did not want to play here in Centerville. I hope for the young man he will get a fresh start, have some new male mentors in his life that he will listen and take advice from, and above all keep the grades up.
Well I hope that Devin does run track at Wayne will only make him better. As for the DB or RB not wanting to play them, well if he wants on the field this year he will not have a choice. Harris will be the QB now after that he will have a chance.
All this talk about the Wayne/Butler game is crazy. 1st it takes both AD's to get out of the game. Who is to say that Minton called the Butler AD and said do you want to play this game or not. We dont know this. Wayne could get out of this game and only play 9 games and that would help them get in the playoffs, or they can play the game and have 6 home games this year like we do. Last note is games are not won on the size of kids in your school or the name of the school. They are won on the field so any given Friday night any thing can happn
All this talk about the Wayne/Butler game is crazy. 1st it takes both AD's to get out of the game. Who is to say that Minton called the Butler AD and said do you want to play this game or not. We dont know this. Wayne could get out of this game and only play 9 games and that would help them get in the playoffs, or they can play the game and have 6 home games this year like we do. Last note is games are not won on the size of kids in your school or the name of the school. They are won on the field so any given Friday night any thing can happn
The "anything can happen" argument is stupid. They have classifications in sports for a reason.
Butler opted out of the Centerville game. I am sure they wanted to opt out of the Wayne game. You don't have to be real smart to figure it out.
Didn't Springboro play Centerville the last 2 years? If I'm not mistaking they play them again this year as well as Fairmont
Lebanon plays centerville and fairmont this year
Fairborn plays Northmont And Beavercreek
Xenia plays Wayne and Springfield
There were several years where Springboro never played a crossover against a Central team. They did finally have to play Centerville and it did the same to them as it would to the North teams. They got beat up physically and never recovered. The same happened to Miamisburg the past few years.
Why don't the best teams play the best teams in the crossovers? Shouldn't Springboro and Lebanon be playing Centerville and Wayne from the Central?
Instead, we get Butler vs Wayne, Centerville vs Greenville, and Sidney vs Northmont this coming year. All are mismatches. Who does the best North team, Trotwood, get? Fairmont.
For anyone who thinks I am a "hater", they are stupid. I think the GWOC Central is a very loaded and talented football conference. I think that Fairmont and Beavercreek are actually good DI teams more often than not. However, they just can't beat Wayne, Centerville, and even Springfield or Northmont, as all 4 of those are terrific or talented teams of late. Asking schools then who are half the size, even a third the size, of the central teams to play these crossovers is stupid.
Butler(420) vs Wayne(800)
Greenville (352) vs Centerville(1100)
Sidney(413) vs Northmont (716)
Piqua(437) vs Beavercreek(960)
Troy(552) vs Springfield(857)
Trotwood, the class of the GWOC North and the state in DII, drew West Carrolton and Fairmont in their crossovers.
These numbers are just overwhelming. When you look at it in terms of percentages, it would be like Northridge (190), Van Wert (223) , or Springfield Northwestern (223) having to play the North teams.
I agree that everyone has that fighting chance. However, the deck is definitely stacked against the North teams. I also completely agree this is of their own doing, or at least that of their administrators. How those morons thought this was good for them is beyond me. I think it is jut unfair to ask the KIDS, those who will be playing the games, to have to do this. That is where I think it is unfair and wrong.
At first the North fans use to say they didn't get enough credit now it is they are being treated unfair. Im sure if Butler really wanted out of this game they could. It would be easier for Butler to find another opponent that week then Wayne though and I dont see any benefit of playing 9 games
discussion all of you guys are having. My thought is that the number of boys in the school doesnt really matter it is the number of boys that are football players. Trotwood does not have a lot of boys, they will likely be D3 in 2013, but they do have a lot of football players. Alter does not have a lot of boys, Fairmont does, when is the last time Fairmont beat Alter on the field? I understand that the more boys you have the more you have to pick from but only 11 can play at a time and in our league with the exception of Sidney teams get decent numbers.
At first the North fans use to say they didn't get enough credit now it is they are being treated unfair. Im sure if Butler really wanted out of this game they could. It would be easier for Butler to find another opponent that week then Wayne though and I dont see any benefit of playing 9 games
Again, BOTH teams have to opt out. So, no, Butler could not get out unless Wayne agreed to ti.
If Butler does not win too many games this year, then Wayne would be better off for points and playoff standing playing 9 games. Some of the private schools have done this several times.
discussion all of you guys are having. My thought is that the number of boys in the school doesnt really matter it is the number of boys that are football players. Trotwood does not have a lot of boys, they will likely be D3 in 2013, but they do have a lot of football players. Alter does not have a lot of boys, Fairmont does, when is the last time Fairmont beat Alter on the field? I understand that the more boys you have the more you have to pick from but only 11 can play at a time and in our league with the exception of Sidney teams get decent numbers.
When you have 11 and they have 22, you are in trouble. Your 11 go both ways while the big DI schools 2 platoon.
Trotwood gets the benefit of sometimes playing with other teams players which have transfered or moved in. That definitely helps.
Private schools are completely different from public schools and you can not compare the numbers and populations there.
You hit the nail on the head. The more kids you have, then the better chance you have of finding good ball players. When the numbers are so skewed to one side, in this case the Central, then it is unfair and stupid for those games to be played.
The "anything can happen" argument is stupid. They have classifications in sports for a reason.
Butler opted out of the Centerville game. I am sure they wanted to opt out of the Wayne game. You don't have to be real smart to figure it out.
No, it's fact! LaSalle defeated X in 2010 by 3 to win a share of the GCL title. Yet, in the playoffs, X whooped up on LaSalle by 14 or so. Moeller was 9-0 (I'm pretty sure) heading into the last regular season game in 2009 and an inconsistent X team upset them 13-10 to win the GCL title. A 3-5 Elder team defeated a 9-0 LaSalle team to spoil LaSalle's only hope for their 1st undefeated regular season in 2010.
ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN IS THE TRUTH!!! That's what makes high school football such a thrill.
When you have 11 and they have 22, you are in trouble. Your 11 go both ways while the big DI <a class="inlineAdmedialink" href="#">schools</a> 2 platoon.
Trotwood gets the benefit of sometimes playing with other teams players which have transfered or moved in. That definitely helps.
Private schools are completely different from public schools and you can not compare the numbers and populations there.
You hit the <a class="inlineAdmedialink" href="#">nail</a> on the head. The more kids you have, then the better chance you have of finding good ball players. When the numbers are so skewed to one side, in this case the Central, then it is unfair and stupid for those games to be played.
When you have 11 and they have 22, you are in trouble. Your 11 go both ways while the big DI <a class="inlineAdmedialink" href="#">schools</a> 2 platoon.
Trotwood gets the benefit of sometimes playing with other teams players which have transfered or moved in. That definitely helps.
Private schools are completely different from public schools and you can not compare the numbers and populations there.
You hit the <a class="inlineAdmedialink" href="#">nail</a> on the head. The more kids you have, then the better chance you have of finding good ball players. When the numbers are so skewed to one side, in this case the Central, then it is unfair and stupid for those games to be played.
Lol as a matter of a fact he was completely disagreeing with you. Jeez your somethin else write another paragraph in response. Give me something to laugh about.
No, it's fact! LaSalle defeated X in 2010 by 3 to win a share of the GCL title. Yet, in the playoffs, X whooped up on LaSalle by 14 or so. Moeller was 9-0 (I'm pretty sure) heading into the last regular season game in 2009 and an inconsistent X team upset them 13-10 to win the GCL title. A 3-5 Elder team defeated a 9-0 LaSalle team to spoil LaSalle's only hope for their 1st undefeated regular season in 2010.
ANYTHING CAN HAPPEN IS THE TRUTH!!! That's what makes high school football such a thrill.
Completely different animal when talking about the private schools. Also, all the schools you mentioned are DI. Did you not know that? Seriously, you didn't know a difference?
Lol as a matter of a fact he was completely disagreeing with you. Jeez your somethin else write another paragraph in response. Give me something to laugh about.
Please stop with the personal attacks. It only makes you look more pathetic. If you have something to contribute, please do so. Otherwise, you just keep showing your ignorance. As for him disagreeing with me, I guess you do not recognize sarcasm. Most people with a low IQ can not pick up on sarcasm, so this is not shocking to me. Well, in some ways it is. I mean, you can type and have access to the web, yet you made a post like this. In some ways, that is shocking. One would think that if you were smart enough to type, then you would pick up on the sarcasm of my post.
How many seasons did Springboro not play a singel team from the Central?
They came into the league in 05 but they were still d2 and went 12-1 losing 3rd round of playoffs to Carrol. They beat 4 division 1 teams that year. They didnt play a Central team the first year but from there on
06: Springfield North and Fairmont
07:Fairmont
08:none
09:none
10:Centerville
11:Centerville
When you have 11 and they have 22, you are in trouble. Your 11 go both ways while the big DI schools 2 platoon.
Trotwood gets the benefit of sometimes playing with other teams players which have transfered or moved in. That definitely helps.
Private schools are completely different from public schools and you can not compare the numbers and populations there.
You hit the nail on the head. The more kids you have, then the better chance you have of finding good ball players. When the numbers are so skewed to one side, in this case the Central, then it is unfair and stupid for those games to be played.
Why cant't you? Alter has substantially less boys than what Fairmont does. Numbers are numbers. Trotwood's transfers/move ins have not help increase the number of boys in the school right? But it has helped in the number of football players which is exactly what I am saying. The sample may be bigger in some places but the games are not stupid. It is like saying Troy/Piqua should not play because Troy has more boys, or that Trotwood and Wayne should not play because Wayne has more boys. I do see your point but I think it is a little overblown.
Can we move off the Butler/Wayne talk for a bit until we start a thread on that come game season?
The facts are;
1. the schedule is locked in
2. Many of the ADs feel its their responsibility to play the cross over games even if some fans think its a mismatch. I remember the saying, "You only get better by playing better teams/people".
I have been involved calling football games with Butler before and have been impressed with their play. I do not think the Wayne coaches will take this as a "Gimme" game.
One person here has taken this argument to multiple threads and I am not sure what real "Dog" he has in the fight, but that is his right.
He talks Numbers as the main issue but then he down plays for example Wayne beating St X 2 years ago in the playoffs (his numbers... Wayne 800, St. X 1200). I see a numbers game there. What about Trotwood beating Wayne last year. Big number delta there since Trotwood may slide to D3 next year based on the new division breakdown.
This same poster calls people "to Stupid" to understand his argument but then complains about personal attacks when others call him wrong. seems like a one way window there.
As in many of these discussions, its all from that persons vision. We all have our own perspective. We should respect that view and hold off on personal attacks or riseing to the "Bait" so to speak.
My personal view... Its not the size of the school but the hearts of the players and coaches that make teams that can compete. I give Butler more credit then the one poster... I think they have Heart... I think many of the teams do. Will they beat Wayne? I never make predictions. Many things can happen between now and then and that night to affect the outcome of any game.
And when its all said and done... its the Kids on the field that determines the outcome... not the Fans, not this forum, not the number of kids in a school.
I am just looking forward to every game I go to. I walk the side lines and see the kids through a camera lens... I see the looks in their eyes... the determination and also at time the sorrow... I see them go from Freshman to Seniors... many go on to college, some playing football, some not... and each one will remember Friday nights in Uniform and the games they played... win or lose... When I deploy over seas... I talk with young guys far away from home and we talk football (even if they did not play), they talk about their "Friday Nights" at the games. It brings them home for a few minutes. When they can, they tune in on the internet when we broadcast Wayne games... it reminds them of home. We have gotten emails in the press box from places the world over during games.... it ties us all together at some level.
Lets keep the kids in mind as we post... On this Forum... we live through what they do... they do not live through what we post.
Why cant't you? Alter has substantially less boys than what Fairmont does. Numbers are numbers. Trotwood's transfers/move ins have not help increase the number of boys in the school right? But it has helped in the number of football players which is exactly what I am saying. The sample may be bigger in some places but the games are not stupid. It is like saying Troy/Piqua should not play because Troy has more boys, or that Trotwood and Wayne should not play because Wayne has more boys. I do see your point but I think it is a little overblown.
I think he is saying if your an elite playoff contender you shouldn't drop unless its a private school. Even though teams like Steubenville,Trotwood,Avon,Tri-Valley,Kings,Jonathan Alder etc.... play up regularly.
Please stop with the personal attacks. It only makes you look more pathetic. If you have something to contribute, please do so. Otherwise, you just keep showing your ignorance. As for him disagreeing with me, I guess you do not recognize sarcasm. Most people with a low <a class="inlineAdmedialink" href="#">IQ</a> can not pick up on sarcasm, so this is not shocking to me. Well, in some ways it is. I mean, you can type and have access to the web, yet you made a post like this. In some ways, that is shocking. One would think that if you were smart enough to type, then you would pick up on the sarcasm of my post.
When your "facts" are proven wrong by the real facts, kinda like vamps did earlier on this page you ignore it. Vamps proved your "facts" wrong Cats just proved your "facts" wrong to. I see you had no response when Vamps proved you wrong about the small schools. You said Springboro plays no one from the Central and they have in every year since 06 but 2 seasons. All im saying is that its you versus the whole message boards on this one, no one agrees with you. You can say outrageous things all you want and hold whatever opinions you want but when you come on here spouting bold "OPINIONS" and than telling other people that there OPINION is wrong and thats yours is right is when you deserve for someone to call you out. Its an OPINION jack*** there is no wrong or right and no one had a problem with your opinion until you started talking sh**. Everyone is tired of hearing about this if you want to talk about it start up a Wayne vs Butler thread because this is not what this thread is intended for. You have been taking other peoples posts directed towards you that are obviously disagreeing with you and than you say....."Yeah see thats exactly what im talking about". Bro they are disagreeing with you yet you take them out of context and twist the words in order for yourself to believe that people agree with you. Sad.
So IF Butler happens to beat Wayne and assuming Wayne has an 8 to 9 win season. Butler will probably make the playoffs with 5-6 wins and then they will be thanking God they played Wayne this year and got all those computer points from them.
I'm sure their isn't one kid on Butler's football team saying, "man we got to play Wayne this year, we suck, they're awesome, they're going to kick our a**." and if there is they shouldn't be playing football. I would bet they can't wait to step on the field with Wayne and try and shock the area.
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