Princeton v. Middletown

[oldschool23]

Arguably the best teams in cincinnati.(Aiken no longer because of coaching) In a one game scenario on a neutral court. Who ya got?

[Purplematt]

Well they only play once this year due to GMC Scheduling and its at Princeton ( I think February).

Right now Princeton is the favorite, but not by much.

[morecowbell]

what are the rosters looking like? what are the key matchups

[voice_of_reason]

Arguably the best teams in cincinnati.(Aiken no longer because of coaching) In a one game scenario on a neutral court. Who ya got?

Interesting comment. I am actually pulling for Josh to be successful, but after one season, and all the emotions have calmed down after last season. It will be interesting to see how good he does as a coach this season.

And who is the coach of Middletown? Is Ronai still there?

Bottomline, I think you might want to keep Aiken in the conversation for best area teams.

With all that said, I think Princeton is better than the Middies!

[oxat622]

Last year @ Princeton, Princeton won

Last year @ Middletown, Middletown won

Last year @ Cintas Center in playoff play, Princeton won

I go with Princeton.

[middieplayer08]

Middies are looking like this:
Bill Edwards 6'6 Senior GMC POY Guard Forward and Center*
Allen Roberts 6'3 Senior Guard*
Tony Peters 6'3 Senior Guard Wingman*
Anthony Struther 6'4 Soph. Forward*
Terrell Ramsey 6'2 Senior Wingman
Kirby Wright 6'7 Soph Center Transfer from East.*
Shad Jackson 6'4 Senior Forward
Meshach Jackson 5'11 Senior Guard

Those are the players that i know of who are going to be def. going to have an impact on the team. the Star ones are who I think will be the starters. Everyone on here I think started at least one game last year for the Middies

[HoopHound]

Here's a Princeton roster from last season (I removed the seniors (listed at the bottom), and updated the grade levels.) ...

Retuning Starters from '07-'08
G Orlando Williams G Sr 6'3 180 *
F Stefon Johnson F Sr 6'6 205 *
G Marcus Davis G Jr 6'2 195*
F Anthony Shoemaker F Sr 6'5 200*

Bench from '07-'08
G Marquis Horne G Jr 6'6 200
G Andrew Baker Sr 6'2 160
G 33 Jordan Sibert Jr 6'3 170

Starters lost... Ballew
Bench lost... Finger and Hill

Unfortunately, no fan from Middletown ever submitted a roster from '07-'08 squad when I collected them. :dang:

[HoopHound]

Any ideas which bench player from last season will be elevated to a starting spot from the list above... or is there a "wunderkind" coming up from the Princeton Frosh Team that can claim that 5th spot?

[macnjnc]

Any ideas which bench player from last season will be elevated to a starting spot from the list above... or is there a "wunderkind" coming up from the Princeton Frosh Team that can claim that 5th spot?

Well Jordan Sibert started the season as a player coming off the bench but by the latter part of the year he was a SOLIDLY engrained starter. The way Jordan came on late last year and onto the tournament should leave NO DOUBT that he'll see no part of the bench.

Of course with his steller play this summer, Jordan is now considered a Top 50 NATIONAL RECRUIT and has verbaled to Ohio State.

Marquis Horne; another player that you list as a bench player is ALSO solidly in the Vikes starting rotation for next year I would say. I'm not sure about this but I think he hit the starting lineup when Anthony Shoemaker either left or was kicked off the team. Marquis has verbaled to Ohio University.

The top reserves as I watched them last year would clearly be between either Marcus Davis & Andrew Baker....either one is capable of starting.

IMO the Vikes will miss last years starting point man Jaymon Ballew, he was a pure point man and meshed well with the context of the team. I've heard that Davis will be the guy that replaces Ballew but I feel Davis is sort of a tweener.....not really a 1 or a 2; Davis can play though and I'm interested to see how that will work out.

[oxat622]

I think Davis will start at PG for the Vikes. Either he or Baker can handle those responsibilities, but I like the idea of bringing Baker in off the bench because he can provide more of an offensive spark. Shoemaker is cleared to play after he quit midseason last year. He probably won't start, but he is a good athlete considering how built he is. He starts at DE for the football team and is listed at 6'4'' 244 lbs.

[Purplematt]

Here's a Princeton roster from last season (I removed the seniors (listed at the bottom), and updated the grade levels.) ...

Retuning Starters from '07-'08
G Orlando Williams G Sr 6'3 180 *
F Stefon Johnson F Sr 6'6 205 *
G Marcus Davis G Jr 6'2 195*
F Anthony Shoemaker F Sr 6'5 200*

Bench from '07-'08
G Marquis Horne G Jr 6'6 200
G Andrew Baker Sr 6'2 160
G 33 Jordan Sibert Jr 6'3 170

Starters lost... Ballew
Bench lost... Finger and Hill

Unfortunately, no fan from Middletown ever submitted a roster from '07-'08 squad when I collected them. :dang:


Wow..didnt know you didnt get a roster Hound :shrug: I will make sure that wont happen this year!!!

[Purplematt]

Middies are looking like this:
Bill Edwards 6'6 Senior GMC POY Guard Forward and Center*
Allen Roberts 6'3 Senior Guard*
Tony Peters 6'3 Senior Guard Wingman*
Anthony Struther 6'4 Soph. Forward*
Terrell Ramsey 6'2 Senior Wingman
Kirby Wright 6'7 Soph Center Transfer from East.*
Shad Jackson 6'4 Senior Forward
Meshach Jackson 5'11 Senior Guard

Those are the players that i know of who are going to be def. going to have an impact on the team. the Star ones are who I think will be the starters. Everyone on here I think started at least one game last year for the Middies


Don't sleep on Josh Johnson...nice little PG, but Meshach will be the starter at PG this year.

[T-Bred]

Don't sleep on Josh Johnson...nice little PG, but Meshach will be the starter at PG this year.

If Josh is as small as I remember him being, size will be a challenge for him in that Davis and Baker from Princeton are in the 6"2, 6"3 range. They both possess quite a bit of strength especially Davis who looks like he has added more muscle to his 200 lb frame. I am sure that Josh is quick, but would have a lot to overcome on defense.

[Purplematt]

If Josh is as small as I remember him being, size will be a challenge for him in that Davis and Baker from Princeton are in the 6"2, 6"3 range. They both possess quite a bit of strength especially Davis who looks like he has added more muscle to his 200 lb frame. I am sure that Josh is quick, but would have a lot to overcome on defense.

Good points, that is where Allen Roberts will come in handy at 6-3, 200. Meshach Jacksons speed is a lot like Rodney Hunter's was a few years back. Should be a nice backcourt.

[FFIndiansBBall]

The match up will be one for the ages, I just wish they played @ Middletown and @ Princeton. They also play on a Tuesday night for the one game at Princeton. Let's hope hey both make it to Columbus

This game is going to be filled with division one athletes i cant wait!

[Impala Drive]

I would go with the Vikings, what with the majority of a Regional Team and the knowledge they have beaten the Middies on a large neutral floor.

But thats just it....on the floor Im not sure which Middie team will show up. Sometimes good and sometimes O MY GOD. Would be curious to know how well they did this summer after that crash down at Cintas.

Its a shame they only play once during the season....but thats the price you pay for having a big league. If in fact the game is in February it will have nothing to do with the seedings of the Sectional, but it will in all likelihood be for the City Championship.

Cant wait.......

[greenskeep]

Should be an interesting season.

[FFIndiansBBall]

you said it. cant wait for it to start!

[TP24]

Middies are looking like this:
Bill Edwards 6'6 Senior GMC POY Guard Forward and Center*
Allen Roberts 6'3 Senior Guard*
Tony Peters 6'3 Senior Guard Wingman*
Anthony Struther 6'4 Soph. Forward*
Terrell Ramsey 6'2 Senior Wingman
Kirby Wright 6'7 Soph Center Transfer from East.*
Shad Jackson 6'4 Senior Forward
Meshach Jackson 5'11 Senior Guard

Those are the players that i know of who are going to be def. going to have an impact on the team. the Star ones are who I think will be the starters. Everyone on here I think started at least one game last year for the Middies

Just one quick note to the roster, you mention Kirby Wright as a transfer, which is true, however he grew up in Middletown, still lives there, went to school until 9th grade, now he is coming back home. He knows the players so he will mesh right in without disrupting the chemistry of the team. So I think that gives the Middies the edge over Princeton, it will be hard to matchup against Edwards and Wright, something has to give. Strothers is also back from an almost career ending issue, he will give the middies some serious depth. Just an fyi

[Syca.Aves.Dad]

Two VERY talented teams.

Assuming they both arrive at this game healthy and play to their potential, I'd give the edge to Princeton.

But each have had their moments of inconsistency in the past ... so the highly-anticipated match-up MAY struggle to live up to the hype. I hope not.

Both will have great seasons and represent the GMC well no matter the outcome of this one.

[FFIndiansBBall]

Yes, lets hope both teams come into this game healthy.. remember last year Middletown didn't have Edwards when they played at Princeton.. this should be a dandy!

[Hornet84]

not to far from this game being played. Go Middies

[Purplematt]

Coach Bob Ronai mentioned on the radio that teams should be wary of Lakota West. He mentioned how well coached they are and that everyone is talking Middletown and Princeton, but people shouldnt forget West.

:cool:

[macnjnc]

Coach Bob Ronai mentioned on the radio that teams should be wary of Lakota West. He mentioned how well coached they are and that everyone is talking Middletown and Princeton, but people shouldnt forget West.

:cool:

Nice mention as far as Lakota West is concerned....

One thing I will say about BOTH Mioddletown & Princeton is that at times BOTH can be wildly inconsistant. I wouldn't be overly stunned if one or both of these teams stumbled some for next year. There's a lot of expectation related to these vetern clubs and it will be interesting to see if both can live up to it.

Lakota West may well be the unsung team that makes the noise.
The talent IS there for the Middies and the Vikes. As we all know......most of the time things work out the OPPOSITE of what you expect.

I'll keep an eye of Lakota West...I know they have a great guard in Jordan Hicks and they're always well coached.

[1180ChesterRoad]

I think this game will be a great one to watch. If Princeton gels and puts aside selfish attitudes that sometimes rear their ugly heads then they should be the best team in SWO hands down. The team is absolutely scary, they have all of the ingredients necessary to win a state championship. Early on the only thing that I'm going to question is the mental toughness and leadership of this team. If they can show that they have both of these championship qualities then I see no reason why they won't be heading up to Columbus this year.

[aauplayer]

With the development of Jordan, I believe Princeton would have to be favored over Middletown and certainly a threat to get to Columbus from the SW.
A unique athlete who has really developed over the summer AAU schedule who should be the difference maker for Princeton.

[HoopHound]

...If Princeton gels and puts aside selfish attitudes that sometimes rear their ugly heads then they should be the best team in SWO hands down....

Interesting comment, Chester.

I'm not saying that I don't believe you... I'd just never heard that about Princeton before. :eek: :eek: :eek:

Can you elaborate with some specifics? :shrug:

[HoopHound]

I wouldn't say they are the best two teams in the City but they certainly are among the top. You can have the horses but if they don't work togther or are "uncoachable" then the team will fall apart.

I would not worry about either teams first season, it really won't matter until tourney time

Who do you think belongs with Princeton & Middletown as we're about to enter preseason, Dad8?

[oxat622]

Interesting comment, Chester.

I'm not saying that I don't believe you... I'd just never heard that about Princeton before. :eek: :eek: :eek:

Can you elaborate with some specifics? :shrug:

Well, they have 3 players who are committed to play D1 ball, and another who has D1 offers but is uncommitted. Sometimes it may seem that there are not enough balls on the court for all of them. I know Orlando Williams has shown some spurts where he wants to be the man. However, I saw them play at Miami's team camp and they played with a lot of teamwork then. I saw no evidence of selfish play. They were gelling.

[1180ChesterRoad]

Interesting comment, Chester.

I'm not saying that I don't believe you... I'd just never heard that about Princeton before. :eek: :eek: :eek:

Can you elaborate with some specifics? :shrug:

Just typical selfishness that will occur when you assemble a group talented and confident D1 college caliber players that all want to be the man on the team. Sometimes, players get consumed with stats and who's taking what shots. If all of the players buy into Coach Andrews system and they set the goal at winning by any cost, no matter what their individual stats look like then they should be the best team in SWO hands down. That is all that I'm saying.

[macnjnc]

With the development of Jordan, I believe Princeton would have to be favored over Middletown and certainly a threat to get to Columbus from the SW.
A unique athlete who has really developed over the summer AAU schedule who should be the difference maker for Princeton.

Jordan Sibert is THE MAN for Princeton, there's no doubt about it; he really really came on in last years tournament........I know he made a believer outta me.

[thehasbeen95]

Jordan Sibert is a great talent. The game should be very close if everyone is healthy this time.

[XUbball20]

I think Davis will start at PG for the Vikes. Either he or Baker can handle those responsibilities, but I like the idea of bringing Baker in off the bench because he can provide more of an offensive spark. Shoemaker is cleared to play after he quit midseason last year. He probably won't start, but he is a good athlete considering how built he is. He starts at DE for the football team and is listed at 6'4'' 244 lbs.

I think Andy Baker, will start at point gaurd. He is 6'4 and quicker than Marcus IMO. Also Andy Baker got to play aau this past summer. As marcus davis played baseball all summer. (considering he's a top prospect for baseball)

[Purplematt]

Whats great is that both of these teams have nothing but total respect for each other - January 27th is gonna be a tough ticket!

[1180ChesterRoad]

I think Andy Baker, will start at point gaurd. He is 6'4 and quicker than Marcus IMO. Also Andy Baker got to play aau this past summer. As marcus davis played baseball all summer. (considering he's a top prospect for baseball)

Andy isn't 6'4. I think that the team will be fine with either of the two guys running the point. I personally would rather see Andy at the point if given the choice between him or Marcus. I think Darrien Wilkins could be the wild card for the team though and he could be a really great point guard for the team. The mismatches that he would cause are scary, and that would leave Princeton with a huge lineup, with speed and quickness still.

[macnjnc]

Andy isn't 6'4. I think that the team will be fine with either of the two guys running the point. I personally would rather see Andy at the point if given the choice between him or Marcus. I think Darrien Wilkins could be the wild card for the team though and he could be a really great point guard for the team. The mismatches that he would cause are scary, and that would leave Princeton with a huge lineup, with speed and quickness still.

1180ChesterRoad

Tell me more about Darrien Wilkins

What class, how tall etc etc; that could be an interesting addition to the team.

Speaking in term of matchup problems; the best "natural" point guard THAT PRINCETON HAS (in my view) is none other than Orlando Williams who's 6'4. He's more natural at the position than either Baker or Davis in my opinion.

In terms of Andy Davis's height....I'd say he's about 6'2. Davis is an outside shooting threat who can handle the ball some.

Marcus Davis to me is more of a tweener, a mix between a 1 & 2.

A pure point guard would be ideal for the Vikes...Ballew will be missed. This is somewhat a concern of mines.

They've got numerous options that could "get them by" at the point but sooner or later this deficiency could rear it's head at the most inopportune time.

The Middies on the other hand; have a little point guard (Jackson I think) that I really like and is pure at the position. The VIkes strength on the other hand seems to be overall versatility of it's ENTIRE rotaion.....their players seem to be able to do a bit of this AND that.

[oxat622]

Darrien is about 6'6'' and wiry skinny. I agree that he could be an important reserve on this year's team. He was Princeton's best JV player last year and ran the point guard position. After the huge '09 class graduates, he, Sibert, and Davis will be called on to do a lot in the '09-'10 season.

BTW, I heard awhile ago that Lasalle's PG, little guy about 5'6'', forget his name, transferred to Princeton. Any truth to that?

[Past My Prime]

BTW, I heard awhile ago that Lasalle's PG, little guy about 5'6'', forget his name, transferred to Princeton. Any truth to that?

Jordon Crawford... no truth to it.

[LW Fan]

Darrien is about 6'6'' and wiry skinny. I agree that he could be an important reserve on this year's team. He was Princeton's best JV player last year and ran the point guard position. After the huge '09 class graduates, he, Sibert, and Davis will be called on to do a lot in the '09-'10 season.

BTW, I heard awhile ago that Lasalle's PG, little guy about 5'6'', forget his name, transferred to Princeton. Any truth to that?

Darrien W. is still at Princeton? Someone told me he transferred to another school. Still having him at Princeton will give them depth on the frontline.

[1180ChesterRoad]

1180ChesterRoad

Tell me more about Darrien Wilkins

What class, how tall etc etc; that could be an interesting addition to the team.

Speaking in term of matchup problems; the best "natural" point guard THAT PRINCETON HAS (in my view) is none other than Orlando Williams who's 6'4. He's more natural at the position than either Baker or Davis in my opinion.

In terms of Andy Davis's height....I'd say he's about 6'2. Davis is an outside shooting threat who can handle the ball some.

Marcus Davis to me is more of a tweener, a mix between a 1 & 2.

A pure point guard would be ideal for the Vikes...Ballew will be missed. This is somewhat a concern of mines.

They've got numerous options that could "get them by" at the point but sooner or later this deficiency could rear it's head at the most inopportune time.

The Middies on the other hand; have a little point guard (Jackson I think) that I really like and is pure at the position. The VIkes strength on the other hand seems to be overall versatility of it's ENTIRE rotaion.....their players seem to be able to do a bit of this AND that.

Darrien is a 6'4 junior that offers a lot of versatility to the team. He can honest help the Vikes at different times in the game at positions 1-4. IMO he was on the brink of helping the Varsity out last year, but injuries set him back from getting that opportunity to show what he could do. He is naturally more talented than Davis, he just lacks the physique of Davis. He is strong attack the basket and has a nice pull up jumper, and a strong handle with the ball. Most importantly, he is a very unselfish player much in the mold that Ballew was last year. He is more of a a scoring threat than Ballew with his size to finish around the rim. He'll do the dirty work and rebound and play defense also. I think my biggest concern with the team has nothing to do with the personnel on the court. I want to see who is going to step up and be the leader of the team. The leadership from last year and the intangibles are going to be the hardest things to replace IMO. The talent is definitely there, but as we see the most talented teams aren't always the most successful ones. I think Coach Andrews is more than capable of putting it all together though.

Also, I couldn't see Orlando playing Point Guard for the Vikings. He doesn't have the mentality of a Point Guard, and I wouldn't want to have to rely on him to create inside of the offense. He could be good to use in spurts, but ultimately I like Orlando at the 2 or the 3.

[macnjnc]

Darrien is a 6'4 junior that offers a lot of versatility to the team. He can honest help the Vikes at different times in the game at positions 1-4. IMO he was on the brink of helping the Varsity out last year, but injuries set him back from getting that opportunity to show what he could do. He is naturally more talented than Davis, he just lacks the physique of Davis. He is strong attack the basket and has a nice pull up jumper, and a strong handle with the ball. Most importantly, he is a very unselfish player much in the mold that Ballew was last year. He is more of a a scoring threat than Ballew with his size to finish around the rim. He'll do the dirty work and rebound and play defense also. I think my biggest concern with the team has nothing to do with the personnel on the court. I want to see who is going to step up and be the leader of the team. The leadership from last year and the intangibles are going to be the hardest things to replace IMO. The talent is definitely there, but as we see the most talented teams aren't always the most successful ones. I think Coach Andrews is more than capable of putting it all together though.

Also, I couldn't see Orlando playing Point Guard for the Vikings. He doesn't have the mentality of a Point Guard, and I wouldn't want to have to rely on him to create inside of the offense. He could be good to use in spurts, but ultimately I like Orlando at the 2 or the 3.

Thanks for the info...greatly appreciated

I certainly agree that the point IS NOT Orlando's best position but if need be he can handle the ball; certainly it's a bit difficult to imagine Orlando setting up teammates and running the show.

From the info you provided, the Wilkins kid sounds intriguing and may be able to add some spice to this already LOADED Vikings team.

[1180ChesterRoad]

Yes, I'm very interested in seeing Wilkins on the court. He could really explode and be another D1 player from the school. He was easily the best JV player in the GMC last year and would've seen good minutes at many other schools in the league. He just suffered from being at a school that is loaded with talent.

[Past My Prime]

Yes, I'm very interested in seeing Wilkins on the court. He could really explode and be another D1 player from the school. He was easily the best JV player in the GMC last year and would've seen good minutes at many other schools in the league. He just suffered from being at a school that is loaded with talent.

Agreed. Other than at Princeton and St. X and Moeller, Wilkins would have either started or been top two off the bench at any other school in Cincinnati last year. He was just in a situation where there were a TON of good or older players ahead of him.

[FFIndiansBBall]

were the 10 players ahead of Wilkins actually better than him?

[1180ChesterRoad]

were the 10 players ahead of Wilkins actually better than him?

It's not really about who is better than who but more so who was able to perform certain roles that the team needed fulfilled. It always isn't about who is the most talented in opposition to the best fits and the teams needs.

[oxat622]

Agreed. While Darrien is probably a better all around basketball player than Greg Finger or Andrew Hill, those two filled necessary roles that Darrien couldn't.